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Editorial: Dump Rove / The investigation moves closer to the president


Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

As the Valerie Plame case becomes increasingly the Karl Rove case, and as the rising water of it begins to lap closer to President Bush, there are several truths about this matter that are worth keeping in mind.

1. In the very beginning Mr. Bush said that it was unlikely that the leaker would ever be found. There is every reason to believe that he would then have taken steps to make that true.

2. It is now clear that presidential adviser Karl Rove did discuss Valerie Plame with reporters, however those discussions are now being described or construed. Mr. Bush said he would fire anyone in the White House who did that.

3. The concept of nailing someone (Valerie Plame, the CIA agent) for what her spouse may have done is unforgivably retrograde in 2005. (Ms. Plame's husband, Joseph Wilson, is the former ambassador who said that President Bush's State of the Union claim that Iraq had bought uranium was false.)

4. "Outing" a CIA agent is clearly a national security affair. The Bush administration allegedly regards national security very seriously. Mr. Bush's father, former President George H.W. Bush, was head of the CIA in 1976-77, so there is reason to believe the current president takes the CIA seriously.

5. As a matter of national security, this is neither a Republican nor a Democratic issue. Former Clinton security adviser Samuel R. "Sandy" Berger was nailed for having pilfered classified documents and thus eliminated from presidential candidate John Kerry's prospective list of candidates for secretary of state.

6. Special Prosecutor Patrick J. Fitzgerald has not yet sung. He is supposed to be a tough prosecutor. That may mean that, however much slippin' and slidin' Karl Rove has in mind, Mr. Fitzgerald may have too much integrity to get rolled by the likes of him.

7. This isn't Watergate, however much Democrats may be licking their chops at the thought of Bush having to choose between loyalty to his friend and a long drubbing on the subject.

In any case, Watergate should serve as an educative experience for any president.

Given that Mr. Bush definitely has other things to do with his time -- starting with the Iraq war -- this is probably the time to just take a deep breath and fire Karl Rove now, before this goes any further.

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... such as it is. This is my hometown paper, and they've certainly been slow to start reporting the truth. This is a pretty good editorial, but they still have to water it down in the end by saying "This isn't Watergate" and "fire Karl Rove now, before this goes any further." They right about Watergate; this is much worse! Although that is not what they meant, of course. And why do they not want things to "go any further"? I want it to go all the way, and expose everyone involved. I don't want it to end with Rove.

I agree that it needs to go as far as the corruption goes and I dont doubt that extends to shrub himself and more importantly Cheney. This administration should fall over the Iraq War scandal.

Watergate involved a two-bit petty burglary and it's coverup. The outing of a CIA agent whose job duites as a "Directorate" of a division of the CIA were to track the proliferation of WMD in the Middle East is no petty two bit crime.

I am a lawyer who has now written several articles on the statute in question and answered perhaps 75-100 questions on it by lawyers and laymen alike and who beleives that the myths being circulated about this statute not being applicable or being difficult to prosecute are just that: myths. I have been able to find no reasonalble legal analysis by any competent attorney to convince me otherwise.

Moreover, the fact that a judge redacted 8 pages of background factual material from his opinion, tells me that he found this matter to be about a very serious breach of national security. I have been a lawyer for 27 years and read thousands and thousands of cases by now and have never seen or heard of such a thing. Then again, national security is not my field, so I suppose it happens; just not very often.

Sometimes I think the media just gets inthralled with turning the crank and forgets where we are in the thing.

written by John W. Dean . His Republican insight is what made me first realize the magnitude of the evil and how bad it really is with Bushco in power, before I saw "Fahrenheit 911." Dean's book is also the first mention I ever heard about THE "think tank"... he tried to warn us about it . The title itself tells the whole truth about what Bushco is doing to us and the world... and yes, Cheney IS president.

Thankyou for that commentary. I for one am glad to hear from a lawyer on this matter.

What insight. To be able to figure out that this is not just like Watergate, is breathtaking. To take the next step and ask why would Karl Rove disclose Valerie Plame's identity, is asking of too much intuitive, rational thought. Editors of the MSM will decide this is more than the American public can handle. Yet, the American public is being asked to exibhit a gifted creative imagination, to comprehend the justifications of the Republican's in the face of facts that contradict their every word. Rod Serling couldn't narrate this.

The sole intent of Karl Rove and the president was to destroy the
credibility of the man who had evidence they LIED ABOUT SADDAMS NUCLEAR WEAPONS PROGRAM still being an ongoing thing. It was done with that intent and with the tacit agreement of the president and vice president themselves, they had to have agreed to allow this kind of thing because they feared the truth would derail their fast track to an illegal war that was based on vendetta, not on WMD's, imminent threats to the U.S. or any other free nation, or anything else much more meaningful than
these felons having initiated bombing of Iraq months before going to Congress to get the authorization for a war. We have the evidence that the cabal who occupies the White House are fellonious, treasonous LIARS and are directly responsible for the murder of more than 30,000 verified Iraqi civilian deaths (more like a 100,000 of them) and of the more than 1,750 american men and women who'd still be breathing had these men not INTENTIONALLY AND WITH ILLEGAL INTENT decided to launch a war that was illegal, unecessary, and morally wrong in every way. These felons/liars/treasonists need to be tried, and sent to Leavenworth for the remaining days they may life, without any possibility of parole. And we're talking making little rocks out of big rocks, not the country club incarceration thing. THIS WAS TREASON and it was GENOCIDE they committed using our troops like MERCENARIES.

Convict, then give them up to the Hague to be tried for international war crimes.

Or perhaps we should use their tactics of exporting torture? I'm sure there are some prisons in Iran that would be happy to take over the questioning that we don't get answers to.

Oo

The privatized plan for Bushco

I agree, but unfortunately, the Hague prison probably wont be half as unpleasant as Leavenworth.

Let's send them to Cuba! Let them see it really is as bad as reported!

This is not a very good piece of work. The writer does OK for the first six points, but then doesn't take the next logical step which is the cover up of lies going on by the administration regarding the reasons for going to war. The next logical step is to connect the Rove smear campaign to the reasons behind it; protecting the lies the administration were selling Congress and the American people in regard to invading Iraq. That then leads to questions that reporters like this should be asking; why has Congress not started a resolution of inquiry. Though I commend any MSM for starting to cover this and related stories, they must start putting all of the pieces together.

they wimped out at the end. On the other hand, this is one of two recent PG editorials that have become increasingly crititcal. They just need to connect the dots. For the PG, this is a big step forward.

It's good to hear that coverage may be ramping up in your part of the country. I hope it's a trend.

I agree its good to see the MSM going after all this. We should stop bashing them and keep encouraging them to investige and dig deeper. After all it was the MSM led by the Washington Post that ultimately brought Nixon down.
As many have said the impeachable crimes of "High Treason" of this administration makes Nixon look like a choir boy.
Maybe this whole Rove thing will be the lynch pin that brings it all down. To me its past time to debate the corruptness of this administration. We need to bring it down...IMPEACH NOW!!!

It’s good to see the Washington Post and the NY Times on the case. Question is, is this just a ploy, or do they actually intend to pursue the thing.
Either way, this whole thing has pointed out that we have a serious media problem in this country. Maybe that should be our next project.

You're giving these guys much more credit then they deserve. Above the law, accountable for nothing, ruthless, heartless vindictive rat-bastards.

Lets talk about how deep this goes. Lies, deception and unaccountability are the hallmarks of this administration. What makes things worse is that they have all found a way to coat themselves with Teflon. Nothing sticks to these guys.

After all the treachery and lies, it amazes me how they still stand before us as our leaders, firing on all cylinders.

What they do is part of the problem. The fact that our system can be exploited in such an obvious way may be much more problematic.

How can they get away with the things they do? The DSM, Rove, everything else?

We know what is wrong with them. My question is what is wrong with us?

We gotta keep our eyes on JEB while we impeach the White House.

President Bush will fire Carl Rove at his own peril, since the very nature of slime is to hold on. Rove knows too much. If we get to Rove, we get to the President at the same time......DO NOT LET UP MY FELLOW CITIZENS!!!!

Even if Rove is fired he won't really be going away. He will disappear into the shadow government. He will still be prompting Bush through the earpiece. As much as I can't stand the guy we are probably better off knowing where he is and what he is doing.

I keep thinking of those words from Betty Davis' movie "Hang On..we're in for a bumpy ride" or something.
Think back a month ago - we're on our way - there's lots more information to leak, and it feels like more people will not toe the line and it will be just keep flowing! I think it's the very, very tip of so much more to come. They won't be able to stop it.

Bette Davis is my fave classic movie star... she could always deliver a line and make it her own... in real life she told it like it is.

I keep thinking of those words from Betty Davis' movie "Hang On..we're in for a bumpy ride" or something.
Think back a month ago - we're on our way - there's lots more information to leak, and it feels like more people will not toe the line and it will be just keep flowing! I think it's the very, very tip of so much more to come. They won't be able to stop it.

"Fasten your seatbelts. It's going to be a bumpy night."

The quote is more like----"Put on your safty belts, we're in for a bumpy ride"

But that's close. Hope you are right and the truth comes flowing out.

OMG. I can't believe Rove is gonna skate on this treasonous act. Once again their Orwellian tactics of "War is Peace," "Freedom is Slavery" and "Ignorance is Strength" win the day. It's hard to stave off the deep despair I feel hovering over me. I thought we really were gonna win this time. Bastards.

Regardless of whose side you're on, Karl Rove's lasting legacy will be the elimination of any civility or genuine discourse on the issues in American politics. He has ingrained a third-world, amoral "Win By Any Means" methodology into the process of Federal government which sadly will persist, regardless of which party is in power. There is no legitmate discussion of the issues any more, only character assassination and shrill partisanship. What's best for America in all this is completely lost and no longer even considered. The greater good no longer matters; only winning is important now.

The only thing keeping me "on the bridge" for now is the faint hope that one day soon their arrogance will get the best of them and the NeoNaziCons will all get the comeuppance they deserve. America is horribly diminished in so many ways because of their poor stewardship.

I pray that someday soon all of America will see these men for who and what they really are. I long to see their arrogance humbled; their transgressions punished; their ideology discredited. I pray for this insane war to end and for America to turn from the catastrophic path on which its "caretakers" have placed it.

Please God let it be so.

respectfully,
George A. Gelish

http://www.georgegelish.com

Are really saying that Karl Rove is worse than James Carvell?

The Clintonistas wrote the book on 'Win by Any Means'

If you trust Bush, enlist and GO !

You seem to be a troll Shmat. Why dont you slink back to the corrupt Repub fascist rock from under which you crawled.

"The only thing keeping me "on the bridge" for now is the faint hope that one day soon their arrogance will get the best of them and the NeoNaziCons will all get the comeuppance they deserve. America is horribly diminished in so many ways because of their poor stewardship."

I would just like to point out that the reason this administration gets away with everything it has so far is due to a corrupt and bought media. Until we can get out the truth, ie the real information, reported by real journalists, we will fail to get the attention of the critical mass. So what is it that we need to do to get everyone on board? We have to get the right information out to the people. Information is the key, and when the information is slanted by a controlled media, it's no wonder the common American is completely misinformed.

We need media reform and even more we need election reform. As it is now, the key majority is missing the right information, and even still if they had it, we need to make sure the vote counts and there is accountability.

Further more, we can do this, we can take our country back for the people, and we will do it because we all know that all of this really comes down to good information, good reporting, and common sense. We are on the right path (thanks to the daily show, FSTV, and the such) so don't turn apathetic zombie citizen just yet!

It is quite premature to assume that they will get away with it. Read Danial Schorr's commentary and you may believe otherwise. It really seems to be heating up now. If Bush continues to try to ignore the growing scandal it will further tarnish his credibility and make him the lamest duck in a long time. I expect that's what he'll do though for as long as he can. The whole Memogate/illegal war/Rove/Plame scandal must become the political ruin of this administration if there is to be any chance of establishing something akin to representative government in this country. If not, it will prove that a corrupt administration can always get away with subverting the will of the congress and the public through deception. Reagen got away with it with Nicaragua but it remains to be seen if Bush will get away with it. I think this administration's hubris has and continues to be so great that they will fall from it.

There is nothing here. Rove did not out Plame.
What we are watching is an MSM feeding frenzy during a slow news time. This is actually kind of funny, many people are acting like there is blood in the water, when in fact it is red dye No. 2.

That said, I am kind of courious as to why Judith Miller decided to go to jail...

I doubt that she went to jail because there's nothing there.

It's painfully simple, really.
She went off to the slammer 'cause she's the one who told Rove ...and Bob Novack as well. She was the source of the leak. -cw

a slow news time?

Is that you Jimmo under the Schmask?
Maybe there is an adjoining cell in which you would fit--you can ask her.

In her own words she would rather go to jail than go against this administration as they are too powerfuland she is afraid of them.

Okay, the MSM is awake, but they need more direction. Regardless of the outcome with Rove, we need to keep focused on the major crime of this administration, misleading us into an illegal war. Every time we speak of Satan,errr, Karl Rove, we should also bring up the Downing Street Memos and the reason Joe Wilson was attacked by the Bush White House, or else this investigation is only going to serve as another grand diversion . MSM has to follow the lies and keep their eyes on the prize. Let's demand that they do.

We must always keep bringing them back to connecting the Rove story to the DSM. The two stories are so perfectly connected it's just plain amazing that they don't seem to be willing to make the connection themselves. The MSM are like children with ADD. They might start to do the right thing, but they are quick to get distracted. I keep sending positive messages to people like Daniel Shorr for his very good work on this very thing. Every message helps. Plus we need to keep presuring the Republicans in Congress to do their jobs (the right thing in other words) and start an inquiry.

Let's keep it simple for the Mindless Simpleton Media.

Subject lines can connect things like : Rove>Cheney>OSP>DSM>illegalwar

ITS very disturbing...the greatest hoax;
there was NO REAL INVESTIGATION of 9/11...JUST COVERUP
and there is no conspiracy THEORY...
its NOT THEORY WHEN THERE IS EVIDENCE!!!!!

Search out Marvin Bush/9-11 in plane site
The latest awesome documentary "Loose Change"
Think about it, look at any fotos you have of
Shanks Pennsylvania and the Pentagon...
There was NO wreckage of any commercial airliner.
The WTC's were planned demolitions...
AND (my latest thought)HAS ANYONE ASKED THE QUESTION WHAT WAS MAYOR RUDI DOING IN LONDON COINCIDENTALLY on 7/7/05????????
:o((((((((((((((((

They're like children feinting ADD.

You are certainly correct.
The MSM should constantly piggyback Plamegate with the DSM and perhaps even information from Mickey Herskowitz's 1999 interviews with Tex.Gov. W.

Here's something which will help them change:

http://www.iwtnews.com/

Checking out the website and info...
Story spsd to be no corporate interests; funded by citizens.
Okay with seed money from Canadian Autoworkers, but what up
with the FORD FOUNDATION??? Arent those the guys linked with
the original Busheviks/Nazi Germany???

http://www.iwtnews.com/

VERY DISTURBING: Perhaps they have repented and looking to
repent of their sins. DOH!

"In its development phase, IWTnews is funded by non-profit foundations (including the MacArthur and Ford Foundations and Phoebe Haas Trust), labour groups (the Canadian Auto Workers Union), and contributions from individuals. Ultimately, our funding success depends on engaged citizens making small contributions online -– like the MoveOn.org or Howard Dean presidential campaign model applied to building a news network."

Your analogy might be a little extreme.

that was used to set up CBS News. Ask Rove to state under oath whether he has any knowledge of that.

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