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US troops accused of Iraq 'abuse'


By BBC

Five US soldiers in Iraq have been charged with abusing detainees, the US military has said.

The soldiers are accused of punching and kicking detainees who were awaiting transfer to prison on 7 September, the military said in a statement.

The names and ranks of the five soldiers have not been made public.

It comes on the same day US President George W Bush defended his government's treatment of detainees, and insisted: "We do not torture".

He was responding to allegations in the Washington Post that the CIA ran secret jails in eastern Europe to hold high-profile terror suspects following the 11 September attacks.

The charges against soldiers from the 75th Ranger Regiment were laid on Saturday, the US military said on Monday.

"All allegations of abuse are taken very seriously and investigated thoroughly, and appropriate action is taken based on the findings of the investigation," the statement said.

Nine soldiers have been convicted of offences relating to abuses at Baghdad's Abu Ghraib prison. Those abuses came to light in April 2004.

'At war'

Figures released by the US last week said its forces were holding 13,885 prisoners at several detention centres across Iraq, including more than 5,000 at Abu Ghraib, a vast complex in western Baghdad.

Human rights groups have complained that US prisoners are sometimes detained arbitrarily, and kept for months on end without facing charges or trial.

The White House has not confirmed Washington Post claims that the CIA set up so-called "black sites" in eastern Europe and Asia to hold suspected terrorists.

Mr Bush told reporters that enemies were plotting to hurt the US and his government would pursue them, but would do so "under the law".

"We are finding terrorists and bringing them to justice," he said.

"Our country is at war and our government has the obligation to protect the American people."

The Senate has passed legislation banning torture, but the Bush administration is seeking an exemption for the CIA spy agency.

"We do not torture and therefore we're working with Congress to make sure that as we go forward, we make it more possible to do our job," Mr Bush said.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/middle_east/4416116.stm

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Sure, let's punish a few more grunts for "abusing detainees" with punches and kicks while the Dungeonmaster-in-Chief and his Vice seek exemptions from a proposed ban on cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment of prisoners. Not that they would ever actually use it to torture anyone, of course.

Meanwhile "detainees" of the U.S. gulag are so desparate to escape the endless "non-torture" that suicide attempts, hunger strikes and forced feeeding have become almost routine. And U.N. inspectors are denied access to (and, in some cases, even knowledge of) the prison locations where all this wonderfully humane treatment is being meted out on a daily basis.

What is that vile, putrid, nauseating smell anyhow? It's too strong to be the usual foul hypocricy that the world has come to expect from the "house on the hill". Could it be the decaying corpses of the "the greatest democracy on earth" and the "beacon of hope for all mankind".
__

O nation miserable,
With an untitled tyrant bloody-scepter'd,
When shalt thou see thy wholesome days again.

(Shakespeare - Macbeth, Act IV. Scene III.)

Wow, you REALLY hate America! Are you an American?

Depends what you mean. Who or what do you hate?

America encompasses an entire hemisphere and hating a land mass is an utterly ridiculous concept. Hate itself, for that matter, is a self-destructive emotion regardless of its "citizenship".

It is, however, almost impossible not to loath and despise leaders and politicians of any nationality who instigate and facilitate crimes against peace and humanity. Mere followers may be looked upon more in sorrow than in anger, but even they must bear some responsibility when their nation disgraces itself in the eyes of the whole world.

Well, I think I see your point. I would agree many leaders and politicians should be loathed and despised. It seems politicians are the least among us and routinely disgrace themselves and their nations, and very few deserve any admiration or respect.

On the other hand, these days, it's very fashionable to indiscriminately and unjustly criticize American leaders, while allowing other world leaders to go unscathed. In my humble opinion, the leaders of Islam are the most disgraceful and most despicable among us.

Well, I won't accuse you of hating all of Islam, but I will point out that your opinion encompasses a very broad spectrum on both sides of the issue. Does the comparison include the leaders of Islam within the United States vs all the other American leaders? Or just Islamic leaders elsewhere vs non-Islamic American leaders?

Perhaps you agree with Michael Ledeen that: "every last drooling anti-Semitic and anti-American mullah, imam, sheikh, and ayatollah [must be] either singing the praises of the United States of America, or pumping gasoline, for a dime a gallon, on an American military base near the Arctic Circle."

Frankly, if I were a Muslim, I think such sentiments would tend to make me think very hard about actually hating something or someone, even if I didn't before.

I am not a student of Michael Ledeen.

You are obviously very intelligent and well educated. How do you explain that more than 1000 years before Islam used American foreign policy as an excuse to attack America, Islam was waging war against the West and Christianity? Islam conquered Christian holy lands in the Middle East, and conquered North Africa and the Iberian Peninsula hundreds of years before the Crusades. What was their excuse 1500 years ago?

... I think I'll let someone else deal with the aincient history.

Without commenting on the accuracy of your version, I'll simply say that a lot of people and empires did a lot of things in bygone eras that aren't necessarily a source of pride to their modern descendants. If we are to judge everyone on that basis, .... Well, I'm sure you get my drift.

I would agree that we should not be judged or condemned for the sins of our ancestors. If that were the case, most, or all, of us would be "guilty." My point is, Islam has been "gunning" for the West for a very, very long time. American foreign policy is merely a convenient justification for current Islamic aggressions. It will be interesting to see how things play out in France, and who and what gets blamed for the riots.

Well, I've gotten way off the topic here... I did enjoy your "let's punish a few more grunts" comment. News media whores everywhere continually attack lowly grunts for ANY infraction, real or perceived. Soon, I expect the press to also report every incident of an American solider spitting on a sidewalk.

If you are implying that what was done by the US in Iraq...in the year 2002... can be justified by pointing to any act taken by Islamic people in the last 1500 years, this is truly appalling!

This is an example of the perpetual insanity of human aggression and revenge. Perhaps you don't think like this, but I wonder now how many Americans, or Westeners, do in fact rationalize this way.

With this kind of thinking it would be justifiable for all native american indians to rise up against the descendants of europeans who "waged war", conquered their "holy lands", and "conquered North America" hundreds of years ago.

Then what about the Mexicans? the U.S. "waged war" in 1846 and stole from them what is now Texas, Arizona, New Mexico, California......

In Mexico, they call this war the "US Invasion of Mexico", or the "War of Northern Aggression", or "US Intervention".

What was "our" excuse then?

Nobody wants to be on the receiving end of oppression and injustice....NOBODY!

Gandhi said something about "an eye for an eye" making the whole world blind.

The "Hate America'" argument is the thinnest, most juvenile of all tactics. It instantly "tags" you as a moron. I don't suggest using it.

It is always employed by people who have nothing to contribute to a legitimate discussion directed towards the policy, behavior, agenda, motives, management, etc. of, in this case, a particular nation. That being, the U.S.A.

It is also used by people who don't want to open their minds or see anything in a new way.

Grow up and join a discussion or.......go back to your comfy chair and watch FOX News.

I'll not dignify your insults with a response.

He/she delivered a pretty "dignified" insult, if you ask me!

sodium pentathol

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