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The Associated Press Lies

There are hundreds of thousands of people marching in DC, right now, but the AP reports:

Demonstrators call for U.S. troops to leave Iraq
Associated Press
WASHINGTON - Opponents of the war in Iraq marched by the tens of thousands Saturday in a clamorous day of protest, song and remembrance of the dead, some showing surprisingly diverse political views even as they spoke with one loud voice in wanting U.S. troops home.


Thousands protest Iraq war, economic globalization
By Lisa Lambert
WASHINGTON, Sept 24 (Reuters) - Thousands of protesters flooded Washington on Saturday to stage dual demonstrations against the U.S.-led war in Iraq and economic globalization, and to demand that President George W. Bush bring troops home.


Bloomberg Prefers Anonymous Source:

U.K. Rally Against Iraq War Draws 10,000; U.S. Protests Planned
Sept. 24 (Bloomberg) -- A London demonstration against the war in Iraq drew at least 10,000 people today as similar protests were planned in European capitals including Paris, Rome, Madrid and Oslo, and in Washington. Andrew Burgin of the Stop the War Coalition, which backed the London rally with the Muslim Association of Britain, said there were 100,000 demonstrators in Hyde Park, in the city center. A Metropolitan Police spokeswoman, who declined to be identified, put the number at 10,000.


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I've been around demonstrations and vigils since 1979, enough to know that media reports are ALWAYS undercounted by at LEAST a factor of ten.

Why is it that "objective" journalists who have good eyesight and helicopters at their disposal always rely exclusively on "official police estimates"?

Jennifer Kerr's Associated Press report
includes a photo of a stereotypical angry protester, a shouting male college-student type with upraised fist.

uses a large chunk of the AP text to file its report, but the photo shows tearful middle-aged moms carrying banners.

A reporter's commentary is subject to editorial judgment, and you can't be sure where distortions were introduced. Kerr appears to make an attempt to be fair to the message(s) of the demonstration, and the fact that this year's crop are not all stereotypical protesters: "They were young people with green hair, nuns whose anti-war activism dates to Vietnam, parents mourning their children in uniform lost in Iraq, and uncountable families motivated for the first time to protest." She gives exactly three sentences to the Gary Qualls' counter-demonstration, at the very end mentioning he had "about 150" supporters.

Does that mean there were 15?

Some extensive media commentary is found in my recent essay here:

Its now a cliche: the corporate press scribbles the goverment line 24/7, is there anyone beyond the Beltway who does not at this point know this? Is this another: is the Pope Catholic story...?Leave that non reportage to Newsweek.

I'm a lifelong news reporter, and we don't lie, we don't use police estimates. In fact, most PDs refuse to estimate crowd size anymore.

Get off the anti-globalization crap. It's a fact; work with it. Or would you rather have the old East-West split? In my day (60s and 70s), we longed for world government. Isn't this just another word for globalization? We need it, even if we don't need exploitation. They aren't the same.

'they', please.

When he said "they", he was talking about globalization and exploitation. He said "they" aren't the same. According to his definition of globalization, they aren't. According to mine, they are.

As a life-long news reporter who doesn't know that the mainstream media lies, I'd say that you're either naive, deeply brainwashed or both. The media's record of lying speaks for itself, and is well known today. As far as globalization is concerned, the old east vs west split was as fraudulent as the "war on terror" is today! Only the elite globalists seem to need "globalization". I'm certain the rest of humanity doesn't see much use for a return to feudalism, and the Orwellian nightmare a world government would surely usher in! Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely!

Good grief, man. No, globalization isn't just another word for world government.

I don't understand how a lifelong news reporter could possibly be unaware of the discrepancies. We (at least some of us) might hope that it evolves in that direction at some future time, but it's certainly not developing that way so far.

There is, at present, no effective supra-ordinate governmental system that would be needed to replace the economic inefficiencies of the present nation-state system. Thus, globalization in its current form is almost entirely a corporate enterprise phenomenon and a large part of it's agenda, not at all surprisingly, is the circumvention of any and all governmental controls.

Sounds like you drank the coolaid. So sorry to tell you but raping and pillaging the earth is not going to help anyone in any country. We are on the downward spiral into the world of Mad Max! Wake up and seek the truth before it is to late. On second thought, I think it is too late.

Your day has passed you by old person. You're just another selfish baby boomer. Get over it

Don't be dissing us baby boomers, sonny! You don't have to dis people in order to DISagree with them. Just state your own idea and stop the dissing. Now, I apologize for calling you "sonny", but I did it to make my point. Not very respectful, was it? But I don't have to disrespect you in order to disagree with you, do I? I disagree with the baby boomer reporter you are dissing, but I don't disRESPECT him. To me, and I am a 57-year-old retired newspaper reporter and proud of it, "globalization" is this corporatocracy we have calling the shots in Washington. Huge corporations don't pay taxes and they send our jobs offshore. They are bankrupting America. They owe no allegiance to anyone but themselves and seemingly cannot be governed by any country. See? Bush is just a puppet - they pull his strings. That's why he appears so disengaged and unsympathetic - he is! He cares only about the ones with the REAL power - the corporations which control the world.

Your right-I am 66 years old and I now rely on the college "kids" to do my protesting for me. I do what I can from home but, when it means getting on a bus and traveling to go to a protest, I am no longer up to it. I am just disappointed that there are not more college protests against this occupation as there were during the Viet Nam "war".

Globalization is not a fact. If it were, Bush and Co would be in jail. They have been indicted in world courts. They refuse to acknowledge the World Courts. They Consider Themselves to be the De Facto Rulers and Judges and Juries of the Rest of the World. How is that an improvement? Globalization is impoverishing the world for the benefit of about 28,000 billionaire/trillionaires in a few countries mostly this one. That is not global or fair or wise or good for the world. PERIOD.

I am a lifelong writer/reporter, too. However, I read and research everywhere to get the facts and a lot of my peers in journalism school did not.

When we launched Vietnam protests, it took the media months to finally learn to count. Maybe this time it can happen sooner. Here's a reasonable AP estimate, published at 10:30, 9/24/05:

Please don't pay too much attention to the 10:30 AM story. The crowd wasn't at all impressive until around the scheduled march-off at 12:30 or 1:00 -- after that, it grew like gangbusters. Part of the reason may have been the track work being done on the Metro. It took me well over an hour to get downtown from Alexandria and almost three to get home. I'd guess the crowd at 3:30 was probably 300,000 to 400,000 based on many, many 4th of July's.

That last article refers to a protest in London, not Washington.

At least AP covered the story, and they did end up with the 100,000 number and a pretty decent story, parts of which were copied by other news sources. What upsets me is the fact that neither NBC nor CBS even mentioned this demonstration on their Saturday evening news. 100,000 people (or more) manage to get to Washington DC to protest, and they just ignore it! Instead, they devoted all their news time to Hurricane Rita. And ABC just stayed with the ball game. The corporate media is feeding the public "bread and circuses." Maybe it's time for us to boycot their biggest advertisers. Ideas, anyone?

during this entire bush regime...that is what they have been best at..always having the distraction going for them...they even sunk so low as to use dying people and of all about that jackson-distraction...the trouble is even this anti-thing going on right here is a good enough distraction to keep the sheepol away from the chit the bush cartel is putting together under your noses. What are ya going to protest when he declars him self em-pore-U do any of U no that during a war, with the right puppets in place, he will be able to do dam near just that....if ya need to protest something, better get to the fact that the American sheepol are still letting him stay. it wouldn't do any good to end the war over there now he has already pissed the right terrorists off they are on there way here now and nobody is suposed to find out or bushes plans could get phuked up instead of U sheepol..0-HELL-0 U FUNNY CUTE SHEARED LITTLE SHEEPOLS......

during this entire bush regime...that is what they have been best at..always having the distraction going for them...they even sunk so low as to use dying people and of all about that jackson-distraction...the trouble is even this anti-thing going on right here is a good enough distraction to keep the sheepol away from the chit the bush cartel is putting together under your noses. What are ya going to protest when he declars him self em-pore-U do any of U no that during a war, with the right puppets in place, he will be able to do dam near just that....if ya need to protest something, better get to the fact that the American sheepol are still letting him stay. it wouldn't do any good to end the war over there now he has already pissed the right terrorists off they are on there way here now and nobody is suposed to find out or bushes plans could get phuked up instead of U sheepol..0-HELL-0 U FUNNY CUTE SHEARED LITTLE SHEEPOLS......

To "Little Old Lady": Boycotting their advertisers is a great idea! Actually, Brian Williams on NBC DID report the march; but he did it real quick and then returned to reporting on the hurricane - you could have missed it and never realized he was talking about an antiwar march in Washington. I was listening for him to mention it, so I noticed it and also how quick it was and then right back to the hurricane. (As if the march were nothing). I "boycotted" the game on ABC because I'm pretty well boycotting football since the wardrobe malfunction. But ABC has been better, I think, than CBS at reporting progressive doings. And Ted Koppel is pretty good about it. And Brian Williams was great in New Orleans, wasn't he? He seems to have gone back to his obedient ways, however. Darn! I thought I saw a journalist there for a minute! Naw, must have been a memory. All Williams really is is just another shill for the right wing nuts.

Make a list of who is advertising on all the television stations and stop buying their products. Call them and tell them that you won't buy their products. Ask your children, friends, relatives or whomever not to buy their products. Have them call those same companies and don't buy their products. Especially don't buy from Walmart who keeps shipping jobs over seas and pays so little that their employees need food stamps. (google anti-walmart sites).

Yes, make a list of all the stations and their advertisers which ignore the peace demonstrations and the importance of their messages.
We need an unbiased news. Create something we can sign on to and send to them. I believe that would work, because money not earned and a customer boycott speaks louder than anything else.

Tired of hours and hours of newsreporters flopping in the winds of Katrina and Rita.

We need to have a slogan like make love not war to catch attention. Even if it sounds silly it cant hurt. How about no blood in the soil for greed and oil...

Was at the march on DC, saw this on several T's and posters:

Make Levees
Not War

Well, I was there and it was beyond huge. There were more people than I've seen at any DC 4th of July fireworks show. The last time I saw this many people together was in May of 1971 (also a peace march.) Can't we get a photo from a helocopter (maybe not -- there was just one and it kept flying over and over and over the crowd) or one from an upper-story window to prove how big it was? I know it would take a really wide-angle lens, but seriously. Maybe someone who is willing to print the truth could offer a reward? Just asking...

I, as you, attended yesterday's march in D.C. I also saw the single chopper circling overhead all day long.

I am wondering if anyone has contacted the DC Metro officials. Our buses parked at the Greenbelt station in suburban Maryland. The cost for the round trip subway pass was $4.70. On both the inbound and outbound trips the train in which I was riding was packed like a sardine can, all cars. The L'enfant Plaza station was crawling with people carrying all manner of banners and signs.

What I would like to know from the Metro officials is WHAT WAS THE TAKE? What kind of take does the Metro get on a normal Saturday? I would appreciate anyone with any ideas on this method of analysing the vastness of the crowds posting some comments.

As one who participated for the first time in D.C., all I can say is that the experience was invigorating and inspiring. I am so pleased to know that so many other citizens, young and old alike have reached the end of their tolerance for this fascist administration.

For what it is worth, when we returned to our bus we heard that C-SPAN had indicated the crowds were upward of 600,000. All I know is we could never get over to the main speakers stage on the elipse. We were stopped on 15th Street adjacent to the Washington Monument for better than two hours before we could move on the march along 15th Street then turned left (ironically) to the promenade on the North side of the White House in front of Lafayette Park. As one in the midst of that sea of humanity, 600,000 seems a little short.

No Blood in the Soil for Greed and Oil

The local television people did the same thing in San Diego. There were maybe 2000 at the rally in Balboa Park and the media says "hundreds". There were maybe half a dozen war supporters on the other side of the street and they get as much air time as the thousands. The system is rigged and the media has become part of the problem.

I remember when we marched on Washington to protest against the first Gulf War (yes, there were some of us even back then!) Busses came from all over the US, a dozen just from Pittsburgh. We filled broad avenues in DC for several blocks, and reasonable estimates were about 100,000, but the National Park Service estimated about 10,000 and that was the figure used by the media. If that was 100,000, I can only imagine how much bigger this march must be when the anti-war movement is so much broader!

I also remember a rally in downtown Pittsburgh where we had several hundred people, and there were about a dozen high school boys who just kept shouting "USA! USA!" as if we were at a football game (which I think was their mentality basically). The TV news showed a small group of us, followed by the group of football fanatics, making it look as though the two crowds were roughly the same size!

I wonder if Fox News will even mention the rally at all, or maybe just show a few "green-haired loonies" so they can discount the entire movement as the lunatic fringe.

I was attending a protest in Century city against Reagan's brutal central America policies during one of his visits in the early 80's. The entire block (my memory escapes me, but I think it was Century Blvd) was totally wall to wall people nearly the entire boulevard as I remember it - there had to be at least 10-30,000 people there anyway.

When I got home and turned on the news, all the local media were reporting far fewer numbers, as were local officials. All of them were totally downplaying the significance of the turnout. What really struck me though was the footage shown by a couple of the networks - video of the crowd only after it had for the most part disbanded and people had left at the end. The crowd they were showing was nothing compared to the crowd during the event.

The next day the LA Times and the Daily Breeze also vastly under-reported the numbers.

This was before the mainstream press got really bad.

This same thing happened in Ft. lauderdale when 750-1000 protesters marched in front of the site where Bush was fund-raising for his 2004 campaign. I have hosted several large events with thousands of attendees and have a very good eye for estimating crowd sizes. Aside from our huge group ther were 3 girls between the ages of 10-14 and their 2 fathers with "We Love President Bush" signs. NO OTHER BUSH SUPPORTERS WERE THERE. What did local channel 10 news report? "About 75 protesters were there ... but they weren't alone" and then they procceeded to show close-ups of the girls and they gave the same amount of time to the footage! So we outnumber them 1000 to 5 and it is an "equally represented event" as far as media depiction of the event!! How can one mistake 750-100 people for "about 75"?!? Orwellian it is...

It's all a moot point about numbers at this demonstration now, because what really matters is if its costing the Bush Machine anything. In the late sixties we went in to confront, and even tried to close down the city, and it was the police rioting that actually got the attention of large and angry numbers of Americans, the people who go to the anti-world-trade-protests have the right idea, people are ignoring now the demonstration now, the media likewise, they wouldn't ignore if 55,000 got arrested like they did in 1969, or when the protest went to the steps of the Pentagon, or when people tried to shut off access to DC.
I hate to say this, and I thank everyone who went to this, but until this starts to make the powers that be uncomfortable, they'll let you walk around shouting all you want.

This person is right - you have to make the powers-that-be uncomfortable and/or have lots of violence and get arrested before the media wakes up. Even then, though, the media we have now might not wake up. This ain't your daddy's media, honey! I should know - I turned 57 years old a couple of months ago.

Let's hope we don't have to have a repeat of Kent State in order to get the media attention and the general support of our fellow citizens.

It's true that "demonstrators" by politicall definition will always be marginalized into some sort of annoyance to the status quo. Fear has a huge impact on the people who believe in the war and the Bush regime (and there are many). The Bush machine has relied on this fear to maintain its faithful following, those who believe in protecting the status quo. But what they don't see is that the "status quo" has become a precarious web of lies and wealth and promises strung together with the blood and labor of the other half of the population. The success of our economy is still measured only by the profits of the rich eg: the stock market, GM sales, MAC or Microsoft sales, whether or not we have new stadiums (which "create jobs" by engendering powerful contracting companies with huge profits as well as providing several dozen minimum wage janitorial, concession, merchandise and ticket sales positions.) What about the reality of the economy on an individual level. The only way anyone can afford anything is through credit. How many people cannot afford the gas to drive their GMs to work. How many people cannot afford rents. How many people cannot afford to go out to the movies anymore. People are placated by the entertainment from a few barely affordable products that keep larger companies rich. The whole system has become a game for half the population to play, while the other half is completely in the dark to that fact that it even is a game. Our country is divided, not between the haves and the have-nots, but between the knows and the know-nots. I don't mean "knows" who perhaps are educated and believe in Truth and free speech, they are the idealists (like myself) who are also in the dark as to what is really going on. The "knows" are the ones who have figured out how to make the game work for them. Our country is fueled by an overall selfishness that has been called "freedom" and "democracy". Selfishness has no color, size or creed. And yet it is what our political and economic make-up dictates. It is an insatiable hunger that is growing in our country. This is the status quo which people want to maintain..."freedom" to own and be self-righteous.

Demonstrators are people who believe there is more to what's going on than what it all can do for "me". Naturally their presence will be treated as something small and deviant in the face of the vast spectre of status quo. I was living in San Francisco during the huge and numerous daily protests against the initiation of the Iraq War. Not only did the media downplay the numbers, they also emphasised the cost to the city that the protestors incurred. The only way a protest will be noticed is to go beyond gathering in sanctioned areas. If people are protesting a war, they should fight fire with fire and treat the demonstrations in the same strategic manner as a war. Perhaps use the element of surprise and the same "surgical precision" of targeting that is considered by our generals to be humane yet effective. Infiltrate centers of power, block roads and bridges, get into TV and radio stations... An army operates by having the numbers and the strategy. We have the numbers... After all we are fighting for the very same principles of freedom and democracy as the war-mongers purport to uphold.

More then likely, the Bush Administration ( Karl Rove and company )
will use his "better" response to Rita ( even though it was of lessor
impact then Katrina ) to overshadow his poor response to Katrina.
But blame will come and be directed more to the Democrats who
run the state and local levels of Louisiana's-watch for it!
But remember there is always next years hurricane season.

Leave no grammarian behind. It's "More thAn likely..."


No coverage from Cnn, nbc, abc,cbs, fox(of course)
Does not matter- keep marching =camp out- grow the numbers of people
Ban all the media except Cspan, then the other wimpy, sheepish news outlets will beg for coverage-

Brian Williams, NBC News, mentioned the MARCH in Washington in less than 12 seconds on Saturday night news. Talk about news blackout!

I watch you nearly every night and was deeply disappointed by your scanty coverage of the protest march in Washington. After your candid coverage of New Orleans,. I expected better.
Respectfully, Erica Jong

There was some coverage on CNN but it amounted to an endorsement of sorts of George Bush. They showed placards that read "Support the Troops". Damn, we all support the troops. That was the reason for this march. Duh!! However, interestingly, they did not show the many, many placards and posters that called for Bush and Cheney's impeachment. They also did not note the thousands of people that stopped in front of the White House and chanted "Shame on You". I was there. There were well over 300,000 people there. Frankly, I'm tired of this puppet media that calls themselves fair and balanced. As far as I'm concerned, there was nothing fair and balanced about any of them except for C-Span. It is time to organize an economic boycott. If anyone out there is willing to work with me, let's get this off the ground and target their advertisers. Money talks.

I've got a better idea:
Don't buy another newspaper. Period.
Don't watch the news on Faux, or any of them.
MSNBC did continuous outstanding coverage of Katrina's murderous aftermath. Once in a while the other stations' reporters would break through with something real, but the spin hit almost before the storm was over.
That's it. Don't buy a newspaper. Pick up one of the local alternatives. If there isn't one, start one!
Also, print out great stories from the internet, especially if it's from a "regular" publication such as Reuters or the London Guardian, and pass them out in alternative coffeehouses and restaurants.


C-Span is as phony as the other "news" "info/public service.
They pander to the rulers , they propogate lies. They are servile.
They are as guilty of propoganda as druggie Rush.
A pox on C-SPIN

What we need is a different perspective. Like taking the power to end the war into our own hands. Bring The Troops Home leaves us beseeching a government that doesn’t have to pay attention to what we want. Refuse To Go/Refuse To Fight is much stronger and lets the military know that we will stand by them when they refuse to obey illegal orders — which is what the Army Field Manual and the Uniform Code of Military Justice tell them they are obligated to do. This war is a violation of our Constitution and of international law. Bush is a war criminal. Those who are fighting in Iraq are subject to being charged with war crimes. We should tell ’em to knock it off. Forget this mushy Support The Troops/Bring Them Home Now crap. It just exposes us to the rest of the world as being self-centered, narcissistic Americans. From a 76 year old who was part of the anti-Vietnam War struggle.

The idea of "starving the beast" by keeping young people from joining the military is very important, but doesn't go far enough. Former General and Sec'y of State Alexander Haig once said something like "they can protest all they want as long as they pay their taxes." If everyone who participated in the marches (in DC and elsewhere) withheld 1/3 of their tax payments, it wouldn't be long before the entire tax system would be overwhelmed. Even if a a small percentage were convicted of tax evasion, where would they put all the people?

Poorer people consider this (especially if you're tempted to join military for a job): if you withhold part of your taxes, it's probably peanuts to the government, so might not be worth going after you for it anyway. But if they do go after you, and throw you in jail, you're probably safer in jail than in the military.

In my humble a Viet Nam vet ('68) a member of Viet Vets Against The War ('69-70) a father of 5 sons (4 school-ged and very impressionable)...we need to look at the broad view of what is happening to this country...It's called Totalarianism. As his (dubya) daddy eloquently stated.. " if it looks like a's probably a duck..." And this duck smells of death.

Also to quote a dirge from the bad old days...(from Loggins and Messina's "Golden Ribbons" song)..." ...what does it avail a man to gain in fortune and lose his soul??

We must fight this firestorm of plutocratic insolence and arrogant didain for life with the same vigor and power as they are. The dichotomy is, yes very evident...we are damned near our own civil war. The poor and disenfranchised "societal debris" will rise up. Revolution comes on a whisper...and behind the barrel of a insideous and horrifying as this seems. These people are not screwing around. While we are peacefully protesting the policies and arrogance of this unelected liar-leader...they simply turn off the TV and continue with the staus quo. It will take violent acts to get the attention to the media...Does anyone remember Chicago '68??? The Weather Underground needs to be re-activated ASAP...and start blowing up our icons of greed.

We can change the's dying...(Thank you David and Graham)...

God Save this Country.


Right on, brother, right on. I've been saying this now ever since the election theft in Florida, 2000. The rat-wing bastards hate the term, but this is class war, make no mistake about it. I'm a WWII vet and a radical all my life and this "whisper" has got to turn to a "shout" before that smug bunch of pols, of both wings of our one-party system inside the "Beltway", are going to heed the warning. I may not live to see the end of this, but God grant I do. In the meantime, keep on truckin', it's good for all our souls.

Bush and those he surrounds himself with are cowards and liars. They are every bit the terrorists, both domestically and abroad, as those they claim to want to rid the world of. They are responsible for more deaths and misery than Osama Bin Laden will ever be responsible for.
While I am a firm believer in the need for a strong defense, a proud former Marine and '68 -'69 Vietnam vet, I will do everything in my power to prevent my son from commiting to military service until we have a government that cares for all citizens, not just the wealthy & powerful, and not just those of this country. We are in a unique position to help improve everyone's quality of life on this planet and if we continue down the path we are on, the world will pay a catastrophic price.


When you put things like that on the internet, they notice you too much.

The media AND the Democratic Party lost their credibility a long time ago. One need look no further than to their failure to publicize, much less do anything about, the findings of the House Subcommittee on Assassinations, whose 1979 report concluded that both President John F. Kennedy and Martin Luther King, Jr., were probably killed as the result of conspiracies. (The media has so ignored this story that most Americans still think that the last government word on the subject of President Kennedy's assassination was the Warren Report.) That same media and Democratic Party have also ignored the historically high discrepancies between exit polls and "official" results in last year's presidential election, the same year in which people in the Ukraine used similar discrepancies to decide that their elections had been fraudulent. Ralph Nader is right: The Democratic Party is useless. What we need is to begin now to build a viable third party. It might take a long time, but it will take less time to restore power to the people that way than to do it through the Democratic Party, which has become nothing more than a foil for the Republicans.

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