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Either the Bush Kids Put Their Lives on the Line or...


Sign the Petition of Redress. Either the Bush Kids Put Their Lives on the Line for George's "Noble War" or the Troops Come Home.

A BUZZFLASH EDITORIAL

To forward this petition to all your friends, relatives and colleagues, Click Here.

Uncle Sam Wants You!

Sign this petition, demanding that the eligible children of the extended Bush family, including the twins, serve in George's "noble war for a noble cause" or Bush must bring the sons and daughters of America home now.

"I demand that George W. Bush's daughters, and his eligible nieces and nephews, serve in Iraq to prove their support of Bush's 'noble war for a noble cause.' If the Bush family does not believe in 'sacrificing' for the war and is not willing to put their lives on the line, then Bush must bring the troops of middle class and poor Americans home now."

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They must, however be required to serve in a combat capacity. No Signal Corps. like Al Gore. They need to do the real deal. The heat the sandflies the roadside bombs. They need to be in a place where they wake up to the smell of depleted uranium in the morning.

I assure you...it will never come to pass. Daddy didn't dodge his Vietnam obligations 37 years ago so that he could eventually send his own children of privilege off to have their bodies and their minds destroyed in another insane unwinnable military adventure predicated on baldface lies. Dream on. -CW

It's WE THE PEOPLE, not WE THE ELITE: THE REST CAN EAT CAKE

It blows me away that The American public bought into the b.s of this draft dodgers rhetoric. And his daughters dance the night away at the Republican privileged parties while our beloved sons and daughters lose their precious lives every day so that Dubya can save face. How much more b.s. can the people swallow? Have you no shame?

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

DO SOMETHING.

Why should George Bush dicate what his daughters do? Why should any parent tell their child that they must join the military? Why should any parent tell their child that they cannot join the military? Bush's daughters are not for him to control. They have their own free will. They have the same choice to make as all of the people who chose to become soldiers in our military. If any parent force their child to become a soldier, shame on them. If any parent force their child to not become a soldier, shame on them. Stop using the daughters and sons of politicians and other political opponents as the targets of your ridiculous arguements. They have freewill, just as every other American youth that is of age to join the service.

These young people so-called 'volunteered' and DIED for a PNAC Fascist State they naively did not know existed , and died for the PNAC Statement of Principles instead of the Constitution of the United States of America. If anybody is USING anybody's children, it is Bush with his LIES to his illegal, immoral, unjust, and untruthful UN-noble war.
You are unconscionable . Stop using America's dying and dead and injured young people. They did NOT "volunteer" to defend Bushco's LIES.

I dont think there was one single rational thought in that entire paragraph. People who are old enough to join the military are old enough to understand that once they do so, they are to follow the orders of the commander in chief whether they agree with this cause or not. That's just how it is. If they do not wish to accept that, then they do not have to join.

Also, I have no problem with a parent offering their opinion to their child on their career choice. However, if the child decides not to follow the wishes of their parent, the issue should not be escalated (i.e. "if you join, you are cutoff from X", or "if you join, I will do X")

You are also entitled to the opinion that the military is not a career. However, this is also just your opinion. As this entire posit is just my opinion.

I have a big problem with liars. You state, "the issue should not be escalated". O.K., then why do the recruits lie, harang and misrepresent facts to the potential enlistees? "Whether they agree to the cause or not, they should follow the order of the Commander in Chief". You, IndependentChris are either out of touch with reality or just fell off a turnip truck. I believe blatant misrepresentation , cover ups, stonewalling the public, smear tactics and outright lies prempts your fantasy theory. Reread the Downing Street Memo, then you'll see why Bush elects to keep his children out of harms way and sacrifice other's for his everchanging m.o, which seems to change every other week.
I don't believe these soldiers would have joined had they known the deception that this administration delt them.
Bush should not ask the public to send their children into harms way if he isn't willing to set an example himself. After all, he is the "Commander in Chief".
You seem to have time to blog this site. Why aren't you over in Iraq?

I have not read the Downing Street Memos. I am not a Republican, nor am I a Democrat. I am not a always Conservative, nor am I always Liberal. I am also not always Moderate. I am not arguing for or against this war.

My arguement is that I do not think that it is right to say "Bush should do this, or that" with his daughters. They are their own independent beings. The Bush twins did not declare war on Iraq, their father did. Your battle is with Gee Dubbya, not with Gee Dubbya's offspring. If they see that the military is not for them, then so be it. I'm sure you would not appreciate it if somebody was saying hateful stuff about you based on something that your father did. You want to bring our trips home, yet you advocate that the Bush twins go and join the fight so they can die too? That doesnt make any sense. That's like saying two wrongs make a right.

EVEN IF THEY VOLUNTEERED. THAT is the point.

Hey, I'm just crying foul. You are attacking somebody who has nothing to do with this war. Gee Dubbya's daughters ordered nobody to go to war. The shouldnt be brought into this debate.

The REASON Bush's offspring have nothing to do with this war, and never will, is because they were born the elite. The twins have powers bestowed upon them by birth, and this is NOT right in America. The privileged should NOT have more rights than the lower classes. It does not matter if the twins caused it or not, they should NOT have more power than other kids in this nation. That is WHY we do not want monarchies or royalty to run America. But Bush changed this to a Fascist Elitist nation, against our will. There is a feudal system by birthright, instead of the Bill of Rights. The twins are part of this illegal system, they are not the cause, but that does not mean they are not part of the debate. Their powers are illegal.

The Bush twins had no more choice about being born as a part of the Bush family than you did being born in your family. So, you should not lash out against them for that. And I am not sure what this power is that you are talking about. There is no draft going on!! It's not like Bush pulled them out of the draft. I also dont believe there was ever an occurence of either of them wanting to join the military and being prevented from doing so by their father. They made the same choice that any person can make, regardless of social status. If you do not want to join the military, you do not have to. It is your choice. There is no draft to protect them from!

and debate is not "lashing". Bush is lashing other people's kids LITERALLY by imposing illegally that they be in harm's way, injured and dead . Bush knew to not allow the girls to "join" in advance. You've admitted you've read nothing in advance on these topics, so you probably don't know the PNAC plotted the war a year BEFORE 9/11.
Bush had the illegal advantage and was privy in advance of an illegal war. You are very blind on these topics, as you've read nothing in advance of discussing them.

We are debating on whether or not George W. Bush should make his kids join the military and go to war. This requires no research to make an opinion on. All I am saying is that no parent should dicate that their child can or cannot join the military. That's it!!

And then all of this elitist junk is flying around in here. If there was a draft and Bush prevented his daughters from being drafted, I'd say that is a good argument. However, there is no draft. Bush has not prevented his daughters from doing anything. There is no evidence that is daughters ever wanted to join the service in the first place. So I ask again, what is he protecting them from? What is he preventing them from doing that THEY want to do?

Bush made this war happen, Bush sent the troops over there. The Bush daughters are just living the life that they chose to live. And that life is a life of no military service. There's nothing wrong with that choice. Many youth make that choice. There's also nothing wrong with joining the military if you choose to.

I would love discuss making brownies with you, but if you have never read the brownie recipe, you really cannot even discuss one ingredient of a brownie. How can you discuss one ingredient, when you have not read the brownie recipe at all?

The Downing Street Memos deal with the validity and legality of this War. That is not what this thread is about. This thread is about a parent's right to force their child into or away from military service.

to "join" in advance ( before his election even).

That is totally a moot point. I see no evidence that either of the Bush twins wanted to join the military. So, when did he "not allow" them?

This issue is hardly "moot".

As a parent, you may want to prevent your child from joining the military. You may also want to force your child to join the military. However, you do not have the right to do so. The best you can do is inform your child of your opinions.

?

That is not relevant to this arguement. A parent may be more inclined to want to support the forceful prevention/inscription of american youth from/into serving in the military than a person who does not have offspring. However, one's inclination to force their opinions/ beliefs on somebody else does not have any impact on their right to do so.

is not a river in Egypt.

Umm... what am I denying?

what?

You obviously failed history and civics, you dumb asshole. I gather from your patently unsubtantiated, wildly ridiculous claims that the 'fascist' oligarchy you described is alive in American politics. I doubt you could name any politician whose offspring served the military in a combat zone, irrespective of political affiliation. And that doesn't make this country a fascist state. Elitist, perhaps. And elitism has always been alive and well in 20th Century America. Just because, in your assinine opinion, you believe something to be true, does not, in fact, make it true. You may be able to inspire likeminded idiots with your empty rhetoric, but you're full of shit, nonetheless. Don't try to tell the world that a turd in the toilet is truly a gold bullion, just because you say it is.

NOT reading a thing about PNAC or Downing Street Memos, may I assume that? (I'm afraid to assume , that would make an "ass" out of "u" and "me"). Or not observing what has happened to our American news media (no news is NOT good news). We are definitely in the first or second stages of fascism, basically the mindset (such as yours) of the German peoples that were being brainwashed by the likes of Goebbels (Rove) in the late 1930's (right about like now: jingoism)

http://www.answers.com/jingoism

I can only conclude that you do not know what the word "fascist" means, so I will provide a quick lesson:

http://www.takebackthemedia.com/bushnonazi.html

http://www.answers.com/fascism&r=67

You are welcome to utilize your newly found knowledge to process for more productive discussions in the future.

None of that has anything to do with the fact that a parent does not have the right to force their child to choose one career over another. You may hate this war and the president, but that doesnt give you the right to demand that somebody send their child to war (after all, that parent does not have the right to follow your demands), it also does not give you the right to force your child to join or not join the military.

I AM NOT DEBATING THE RIGHTEOUSNOUS, VALIDITY, OR LEGALITY OF THIS WAR!!

.

Well, if they havent already committed themselves to military service... then yes, that is a correct statement.

remember?

I never said legalities dont matter. I simply said that I am not debating the legality of this war. We are talking about a parent's right to force their child to join/not join the military. US Legal System aside (and I'm sure that a parent doesnt even have that legal right), let's just consider "right" to mean "moral right". And, I am not talking about the moral right of Bush to wage war, because I am not arguing about Bush's decision to declare or continue the war. I am only debating a parent's (moral) right to force their child to join/not join the military.

goes to war

As long as they are not in the military, that is correct (because there is no draft), but if they are in the military, yes he does have the legal right as the commander in chief (for 90 days without congressional approval).

There is no draft right now, so I'm not debating that.

and that noone has the right to demand that someone else's child goes to war. That includes Bush.

By joining the military (voluntarily) one gives the United States Government (including Bush) the right to send them to war. If you dont want to go to war, dont join the military. There is no draft.

yet you KEEP bringing up legalities that you cannot use as your defense for an illegal war. Noone's child can be demanded to go to the illegal Iraq War by a criminal. That is the Nuremberg Principle, volunteer or drafted, the soldier has international rights over the tyrant.

Because you keep trying to steer the debate towards the legality of this war. I am not debating that. I am debating a parent's right to force their child to join the military or not join the military.

You say: "I have not read the Downing Street Memos. I am not a Republican, nor am I a Democrat. I am not a always Conservative, nor am I always Liberal. I am also not always Moderate. I am not arguing for or against this war."

I don't think I fit under any particular label either, Chris, but I really don't understand your position (non-position?) here. The whole purpose of this site is to help people become knowledgeable about issues arising out of the DSM and related evidence concerning the ongoing war.

We certainly don't have to agree on everything, but I think we all owe it to ourselves to adopt some reasonably well-informed postion on a matter of such importance to our present and future wellbeing and that of others as well.

I am not advocating bring the troops home. I am an advocate in the investigation of the Downing Street Memo. This man is costing American lives, and his excuses for war have changed. How long does he think he can go on with his rhetoric? Please.... I've seen Jenna and Barbara on the news in support of their Father's war, encouraging enlistment. What is that about?!! They need to put action into where their mouths are, and set an example for the American public. "Bush should do this or do that", is public opinion. He is still a servant of the American public, not the other way around - and the public has a right to speak, as do his daughters. If they are going to go public and ask other to enlist and support the war, they should do the same. That is where chickenhawking come in.
So, IndependentChris you are saying that they have the right to make their own decisions. Everyone does. But not at the expense of others deaths.

The Bush twins are not making decisions at the expense of others. Their father is. They are just two women that have decided not to join the military. And there is nothing wrong with saying "The military is not for me, but if you want to join, more power to ya!"

Then why aren't they saying the military is not for them? Again, they encourage enlistment. But not for them? Hmmmm..... Outright Royal Scan. They are cowards, just like their father is.

Why should they say that? The fact that they are not enlisted makes it obvious enough that they do not feel that the military is the life for them. And it is not their fault that Dubbya is their daughter. Geesh cut them some slack. Besides, if somebody joins the military because one of the Bush twins told them to... well then that person has some deeper issues that need to be addressed.

Had to correct a blantant typo:

WAS:
"...Dubbya is their daughter..."

IS:
"...they are Dubbya's daughters..."

EVEN if they wanted to! Bush knew his illegal war was going to happen before the 2000 election! He knew before he became president the first time>>> he had "insider information".

That is not my opinion, that is the Nuremberg Principles.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuremberg_Principles

Your opinion is just that> NOT backed up by facts.

Hey, I totally agree with you on this one. So if this is an illegal war as you say, why should Dubbya send anybody (including his daughters) to it? You should be calling on him to bring the troops home, not send more over there. I thought that was the whole point of this protest.

.

in American history. Bush had a form of illegal "insider trading" on this war, for lack of a better term. He knew to keep his daughters out of the military in advance of his phony illegal war.

Also, if you are not a parent, you do not know the parent/child relationship. Parents routinely tell their kids, especially young men, "join the service, go to college or get a job". In neighborhoods with high un-employment , low income parents routinely tell their kids "join the service". It's that or lie around the house doing nothing, and most parents would not tolerate that. A parent , generally speaking, finds it easier to tell their grown child to join up during peacetime. They find the benefits far outweigh the risks for their child during peacetime.

Unless you are George W Bush and you know that other people's children will die, but his own never will.

To "independent" Chris:

When someone joins the military ostensibly to defend their country under the direction of the president, does that not imply that the president is obliged to use good judgement and act in good faith? Apparently not according to you.You imply that once they're in, the president should not act responsibly, but rather enjoy license to act with impunity. This is your version of reason? Well, thank you for correcting me. I mistakenly took reason to be a deliberate conscious mental process whereby one arrives at a conclusion through careful examination of facts, and application of logic, silly me.

No one is suggesting that the eligible members of the Bush family be coerced into service in Iraq, only that their failure to do so makes a clear and unmistakable statement; each of these individuals, given the relavtive prominence and notoriety they enjoy are morally obliged to make a statement.

If they believe the war is just, then most certainly, they should volunteer for Iraq. However, if they see the war for what it is, they are equally obliged to use their position to speak out against it. This would send a more powerful message than a legion of anonymous citizens. And they should do so with no regard to internal family consequences,as the magnitude and severity of the matter supercedes.

As they stand now, attempting to sit on a fence that is'nt there, they make themselves out to be nothing but cowardly, confused little rich kids. With all the wealth, notoriety and privilege they may enjoy, they are due no respect,and no regard other than to sadly note what pathetic little hypocrites they are, and how pointless and meaningless is their existence.

---The Bikemessenger

P.S--for more of my libertarian rants, go to
( http://www.smallgov.org. ) My latest explodes the "stay the course, or those already dead will have died in vain" myth; comments welcome.

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